Becoming “Someone Who Can Make Any Kind of Tableware”

Hanada: What first sparked your interest in working with tableware?

Kodo Kiyooka: About four years after I moved to Shigaraki, a bar I used to frequent decided to open a restaurant and asked me to make the tableware. I barely knew anything about tableware at the time, but I hurriedly studied it and prepared around ten items. The response was far better than I had imagined…

Hanada: You studied in a rush and still got a great response… It sounds like you were truly suited to making tableware.

Kodo Kiyooka: Everyone praised my work. That had never happened to me before in my life. People used something I had made, enjoyed it, and even complimented it (laughs).
It felt strangely right to me. That made me want to work in tableware production, and through a senior colleague, I was brought into a company where I stayed for ten years.

Hanada: What kind of ten years were they?

Kodo Kiyooka: At first, I couldn’t make much at all. I wasn’t hired because they needed people—in fact, they already had enough staff, but my senior pushed hard to get me in. Apparently he told the president, “This guy can make any kind of tableware.”

Hanada: Quite the grand introduction…

Kodo Kiyooka: Something like, “In return, you’d better work hard,” you know (laughs).

Hanada: That’s something to be grateful for, in a way.

Kodo Kiyooka: At that point, I had no choice but to give it everything I had. I had to live up to being “the guy who can do anything with tableware” (laughs). So even after work, I practiced late into the night.

Hanada: You couldn’t exactly practice in front of everyone (laughs). And eventually, you started thinking about becoming independent.

Kodo Kiyooka: This year marks my eleventh year since going independent.

Something Slightly Unlike Anything Else

Hanada: So, what does “a good piece of tableware” mean to you?

Kodo Kiyooka: I don’t try to define clearly what tableware “should” be. That said, I do hope that my work looks a little different from others. I love reproductions of ancient ceramics and enjoy looking at others’ work, but personally, I want to create pieces that feel “just a little unlike anything else.”

Hanada: That uniqueness isn’t just about appearance, is it?

Kodo Kiyooka: It’s hard to put into words.

A Message to Younger Generations

Kodo Kiyooka: I also hope more young people will become interested in tableware. I do feel that movement starting to happen.

Hanada: It’s encouraging to see more people newly drawn to tableware.

Kodo Kiyooka: There are now many more places where people can see tableware. In the past, it was unthinkable for select shops to carry ceramics.

Hanada: Your work seems like it would fit naturally into those spaces.

Kodo Kiyooka: I’ve always felt that these things are all connected.

Hanada: Perhaps that’s why your work embraces the strengths of ceramics without feeling overly bound to tradition or clinging to it.

Kodo Kiyooka: As I kept working, I began to realize the depth of ceramics, but I think that mindset was there from the start.
In fact, around my fifth year at the pottery, I was already holding solo exhibitions at rental galleries in Daikanyama and Jiyugaoka, hoping young people would come. But mostly, it was just my friends who showed up. Friends from my high school rugby club would come out of obligation, but they basically had no interest at all (laughs).

Hanada: A tableware exhibition filled with rugby players—that’s not something you see often (laughs).

Kodo Kiyooka: They’d say, “Kiyooka, I hear you’ve been making jars lately,” and come by. Then they’d introduce me to others saying, “He’s my classmate—he makes jars up in the mountains.”

Hanada: You’d be thinking, “I don’t make jars, and I don’t live in the mountains.” (laughs).

Kodo Kiyooka: When I’d say, “Just take one you like,” they’d reply, “If it’s free, sure,” and pick something…

Hanada: (laughs)

An Experiment from 20 Years Ago

Kodo Kiyooka: Even so, those friends and I went to DC brand shops and vintage stores together, listened to the same music, and talked about movies. Yet for some reason, only my tableware was seen as something completely out of touch with everyday life.
I couldn’t understand why. To me, wearing stylish clothes and shoes was no different from using beautiful tableware. I even brought my work to clothing select shops.

Hanada: That was quite a challenge at the time. How did they respond?

Kodo Kiyooka: They’d say, “It’s not bad, but this isn’t really the place for tableware. Could you take it to a ceramics shop instead?” And I’d reply, “Yes… you’re right,” knowing full well they were right.

Hanada: Despite your passion and drive, you seem rather calm about the results.

Kodo Kiyooka: Above all, I wanted my work to be placed where people of my generation would see it and think, “There’s something fun like this—there’s a world like this.”

Hanada: You wanted people to engage with tableware the same way they do with cars, clothes, or music.

Kodo Kiyooka: Twenty years ago, it just wasn’t that kind of era. Eventually I started thinking, “This won’t work.” The response was simply too weak (laughs).

Finding One’s Own Place

Hanada: You make great use of the inherent appeal of ceramics. Visually, your work feels sharp, with an excellent balance of glaze tones, yet broadly speaking, it draws out the beauty of the clay without relying on it too heavily.
As society becomes more dominated by digital, artificial, and predictable things, people also develop a strong desire for the opposite. Your work seems to contain both. It doesn’t belong entirely to one side, nor does it depend on either. From the perspective of everyday life where tableware is used, your work seems to establish a unique “place.”

Kodo Kiyooka: I personally like both sides. I don’t want to spend all day on my smartphone, but I also don’t believe everything has to be natural or self-sufficient. I think it would be interesting to incorporate something ceramic-like into what people feel from digital things.

Moments of Hesitation

Hanada: What do you mean by “ceramic-like”?

Kodo Kiyooka: Growing up in Shigaraki, I’ve come to appreciate the power of clay and glaze—imperfection, unpredictability, and things that can’t be fully controlled or reproduced.

Hanada: There must be times when things go well, and times when they don’t.

Kodo Kiyooka: I use a gas kiln, and I slightly adjust the reduction timing and peak temperature each time.
Sometimes I choose stability over excitement—I hesitate and don’t raise the temperature enough (laughs).
When that happens, the results can feel unsatisfying.
I think the pieces I’m most convinced by come when I work with the mindset that “failure is fine.”

Oval Plates Make Their First Appearance

Hanada: Is there anything you particularly enjoy making?

Kodo Kiyooka: I like wheel throwing. It clearly shows me that I’m still able to grow.

Hanada: You work with various glazes—olive, ash-white, black…Do you see that range continuing to expand?

Kodo Kiyooka: They’re existing glazes, but I’d been experimenting with applying them thickly and firing at very high temperatures. Only recently has it started working well.

Hanada: Which glaze is it?

Kodo Kiyooka: White. Suddenly, complex colors unlike anything I’d seen before began to appear. It feels very spring-like, so I’d like to include it in our April two-person exhibition.
I’m also thinking about oval plates now. Honestly, I want them for myself (laughs).

Blowing People Away

Hanada: Is there anything you want to pursue going forward?

Kodo Kiyooka: These days, there aren’t many glazes that feel completely new. Still, I want to create something that makes people say, “What is this?”

Hanada: That must require a lot of testing—and many failures.

Kodo Kiyooka: But when you find something, it’s incredibly satisfying. That said, it only works if the form supports it. The atmosphere changes entirely depending on the clay body. Focusing only on glaze research doesn’t work. I want to value bringing out the glaze’s potential.

Hanada: Other artists sometimes talk about your glazes.

Kodo Kiyooka: So they talk about them (laughs). But I’m probably not doing anything as complex as people imagine.
I rarely layer multiple glazes or manipulate ash in special ways.

Hanada: Simple.

Kodo Kiyooka: You could do many things by making it complex, but…

Hanada: Perhaps you understand the fundamentals well. Without understanding them, interpretations become superficial, leading to unnecessarily complex paths—like overthinking a math problem and making it harder than it needs to be.

Kodo Kiyooka: I wouldn’t say it’s anything that impressive, but someday I hope to create something that truly surprises people.

Hanada: I look forward to the day when we’re completely blown away.

Kodo Kiyooka: Viewers also need to be ready to be blown away—otherwise, it’s hard to blow them away (laughs).

Hanada: So surprising someone is a joint effort between the maker and the viewer (laughs). We look forward to the two-person exhibition.

Kodo Kiyooka: Likewise. I’m really looking forward to it.

≪ END ≫